Is Racial Preference Racism?

Yesterday, I was cruisin’ for a bruisin’ (you know where 😉 using Grindr and came upon a picture of a young black guy who had posted a smiling picture of himself with some interesting stats to accompany the profile: “Age 20, 5″10, 150 lbs… white”. Upon seeing this I burst out laughing at the sheer hilarity of it. To give it some context, your profile on the gay, hookup, iPhone app Grindr has a default of no ethnicity so one must choose to post what race they are and second, the “slipped finger” excuse doesn’t apply here as the “black” response has 5 different options between it and “white”. Realizing this choice was more than likely made on purpose I reasoned it was okay to post a screen shot of this scene to my facebook for my friends to “like” and laugh at. Just as I was about to post it however, I wondered: “Is it racist to laugh at this?” I know me, and I know I’m not a racist person but am- like the rest of the world- sensitive to the issue and always try to think before I speak and act on issues of race, religion and ethnicity. In the end, I of course posted the pic and got a bunch of fun and non-hateful comments from my friends regarding it. But, the whole situation caused me to think about race and dating on the internet.

All dating sites- to my knowledge- give the user the option to post their ethnicity, from White to Black to Asian to Mixed/Other and everything in between. Personally, I always answer. As I type that, I can hear a few of my fellow Homorazzi writers rolling their eyes saying: “Of course you do, you’re white!” Admittedly, being a part of what most would consider the “majority race” on dating sites makes it “easier” to click on the caucasion option but where the real rub lies is in choosing to write someone or not based upon their answer to this question. Being as PC as possible and naming this “racial preference”, the term still leaves a dubious taste in my Liberal and sensitive mouth… is racial preference just plain racism? Short answer in my mind is no, but I know there’s more than a couple out there who would vehemently disagree with me.

Would you say that you have a racial preference?

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Many sites (not including Grindr) allow for a “custom search” that lets you screen out guys based on certain limits you assign. Ranging from a height minimum to maximum; a weight category; a physical build type; age; and, race, these limits allow for a streamlined man-hunt that most feel is time-saving and useful as we fly through 100s and 1000s of online cruisers. Not only a search option, many (MANY) men even post “looking for asian boys” or “prefer white or latino” or “black for black only”, and personally, I think that’s their right to do so. I know, reading those blurbs aloud sounds racist but first let’s define that word: racism is reported to be “a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one’s own race is superior and has the right to rule others.” Furthermore, it is often defined as: “hatred or intolerance of another race or other races.” While the former description sounds a little dated and master/slave geared, the latter does seem to argue against the propriety of having a racial preference for what type of man you’re looking for. So, are men who prefer/search for men of a certain race racist??

I still say no. If you enjoyed and would date all races but had a special thing for lean latino boys, does that extra crush of yours make you racist? If you are an Asian boy and have that “boi” gene in you that has you searching out bigger, older white men does that make you a racist? If you think mixed raced boys are particularly sexy then does that make you especially open-minded or again, a racist? While many would weigh their answer to each question with special thought and care, I personally blanket-answer “Nope!” to all of em’! I’m quite a black or white (forgive the pun) kind of guy when it comes to most issues and unless you think people are genetically/socially/anyway unequal because of their race then I’ll stamp you with a big ol’ R for racist, but being more turned on by a particular set of men to me is totally acceptable and pretty much exactly how we are made to cruise/date/love.

Personally, I search for men older than myself, much more built than I am and nearby proximity-wise… do any of those requirements paint me a bigot in anyway? I am very lean and like that for myself, but want a man with muscles. Am I a self-loathing twink? Does my love of gym-boys reveal something messed deep in my psyche from early childhood? Did I watch Kevin Sorbo a little too often on “Hercules” growing up? Well, yes to that last one but otherwise I think I’m not quite ready to be committed to the nut house. Having had this argument more than a couple times with predominantly non-caucasion friends who explain: “You can’t understand, you’re white!”, there is nonetheless a recent insurgence of profile by white males who announce their desire to date all races and that those who don’t “Are F-ing racists in denial!”. While I defend their right to say whatever they wish (within the bounds of decency and the rules of the site they’re posting on), I still disagree with their position.

Often this issue comes down to two things: what turns you on and what do you know. A lot of the time men opt for what is similar (similar education, religion, size and race): is this a matter of feeling comfortable with the familiar or hating and bigoting the unknown? I love meeting a guy and finding out we grew up in the same small city or have travelled to the same remote town in Spain: there’s an instant bond that is created that not only opens the date up to me but that relaxes me a little in those oh-so-nerve racking early stages. Then, there’s the “what gets ya goin’?” factor that I believe is at the root of this issue for those who would claim this preference to be one of rudeness and unjust dating practices. I can’t tell you the amount of times I heard the words: “[Insert race here] guys just do it for me!” Most often however, this statement is whispered or spoken while carefully eyeing the room for outliers who don’t match the inserted race preference. One would never hush the words: “I like redheads” (well, maybe one would… come on, gingers? Haha kidding!), but we would if the issue concerned race. Why isn’t it wrong to have a thing for- hell even a limitation to brown-eyed guys? I have never understood the attraction of eyes but have heard a litany of times that it is one of the most important factors for some when choosing a potential beau. I think that’s just fine.

While denouncing a race, stereotyping them negatively or believing them to be less-than is absolutely not okay and intolerant, I argue that if particular races have pronounced effects on your libido then go with it. Sure, take a look at why that feeling is there: is it because you’re looking for your Taye Diggs, or is it because you think all Asians are going to be bad in bed? Do you choose your friends/employees/etc based on their race or does this matter only play a role in what makes the erection erect? I see relevant differences in all these juxtaposed thought patterns.

I know this polemic and my position in it is a bit of a sensitive one for many out there but I wanted to hear how people felt about it. Setting aside the poor-me notion of “white guilt” and the disproportionate abundance of caucasion models in ads and commercials, I do accept that being among the “majority group” (even though funnily enough, in the world at large I am not and even in my city I am technically a minority as a white male), it is easier to say I don’t mind when people don’t date me cause “I’m white”. I likely get turned down a LOT less than others do due to my blond hair n’ blue eyes and I can understand how frustrating it would be to not be even given a chance because the guy I poked doesn’t like my ancestry. But, I’ve been turned down countless times because I’m not big enough or short enough etc and claiming bigoted practices doesn’t even come to mind. Again, maybe I just have it too easy to see it from the outside.

Finally, this is by no means a “gay only” topic- though being already a “minority” group I feel it’s particularly charged for our community- straights and bis alike deal with this exact issue and I welcome their valued input on this one as well! I’d love to hear what everyone thinks about this dating/cruising practice… I know most of us hide our clicked “search for” ethnicity boxes on our Manhunt profile when friends come over and want to borrow the laptop, but I say stand up for what you do or else maybe there really is something wrong with why you have that preference.

Do you think racial preference is racism?

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  • Rodney Holston

    This guy, someone get him a cookie pronto!

  • Rodney Holston

    1. Looking at a guy and going, “not interested” is one thing. Looking at a guy and saying, “ugh, I do NOT date {insert race here} people, gross!” should earn you a special place in Hell.
    2. I’m mixed race so sometimes it’s a little hard to tell where I fit. I’ve had guys tell me, “um, not usually into black guys but you’re cute” and that turns me off something fierce. But at times I’ll click a guys profile and he’ll have that “no blacks” disclaimer and I dunno if I’m included.
    3. If you’re not naturally attracted to someone, fine. As gay men we should get that. But if your reasons have to do with stereotypes or perceived behaviors of a certain race than I feel you’re a little bit racist.
    4. Lastly, I think some of this is just leftovers from our stupid, ignorant elders and their Stone Age way of thinking. I know some people still get up in arms over people “mixing races”, actually had a teacher my senior year of high school tell our class she didn’t believe in it and that we should stick to our own kind. So I think that honestly, some of that old racism has evolved into a new type where we stay away from what we don’t know and what our parents and grandparents don’t know. Some of those old ideas are just too strong and won’t completely go away.

  • Rodney Holston

    You’re speaking about a small percentage of African Americans. Not honest with their feelings? Ever heard of “in the closet”? Some people don’t wear their sexual orientation on their foreheads, and it’s not just black men. The people bumping into you? Sweetie, you live in New York, get out of the damn way, said you’ve been there for decades dammit. And you’re making that touching stuff up in your head because you think that since African Americans have this infatuation with Asians that you’re somehow very special and people will slyly try to touch you. Nope, you’re not Beyoncé. You’re on a crowded train. And I’ve always been aware of black men being attracted to Asians. It’s right up there with “black guys love heavyset white women.” Chris Brown’s video for “Fine China” is a prime example of it and I personally know a few black guy/Asian girl couples. Just for the record, mixing the two usually results in pretty cute babies 🙂

  • Rodney Holston

    Well judging by your little picture, you don’t look mixed at all so that could have something to do with it. But it’s a small pic, so I can’t really tell.

  • Douggseven

    I’m not racist, but my penis is. There are some races as a whole I just don’t find attractive and I wouldn’t be able to get an erection around. Does that make me evil? I remember hooking up with an asian guy once to test myself and being so uncomfortable, i had to end the date prematurely. Does that make me a bad person? Shouldn’t I get points for trying?

    I don’t like onions either. Should I force myself to eat them? Who would do that, and why?

  • hey

    soon, we’re gonna be accused of misogyny for not being attracted to woman

  • Well honey, I am white, old and live in SE Kentucky and I be damned if you ain’t racist! You may also wanna see a doctor about the touching issue, sounds like you may have Haphephobia. Sounds like early stage so get there quick!!! Or lock yourself in your home and stay the f*ck there-I think racist people should removed from society. We have all been on this planet for far too long to comprehend that we ain’t all a like-suck f*ckin’ evolve!

  • Rico

    I couldn’t decide if I was going to comment on this or not. But I decided I would go ahead and thrown in my 2 cents. Yes, everyone can have a preference and go out on a date with whoever they want to, that’s not the problem there but if I were in a club and I walked up to an Asian guy and said I’m not interested in you because you’re Asian I would be labeled a “dooshbag” or worse. Its all about the context. Besides all African Americans aren’t the same, all Asians aren’t the same, hell all Caucasians aren’t the same. Don’t rule out a FULL race of people because you don’t like the color of there skin. I mean being a minority a gay person in America already comes with a socialized stigma why does the gay community add more to it by announcing there “dislike” of there brothers and sisters. What I’m saying is you can have your racial preference, sure, but don’t outright say I don’t like you because you are a ____ *insert racial preference here. Hell most of the people who say that don’t even want to be friends with the person 9 times out of 10. I am an openly gay African American man and I like all flavors INCLUDING my own. I’m not going to close myself off from love because its what society/racialized (lol) wants me to do. There is SOOOOOO MUCH history behind the using of race in a sexualized matter and frankly it stings us minorities out here to hear the whole “I don’t like you because of ____” because of the history and if you don’t know why it aggravates some people, open up a history book.

  • blaze

    what a sad existence…you don’t like onions?!

  • jthemac

    How is this even a debate? If you said “I’m not attracted to blondes” would anyone care? What physical traits you’re attracted to is hardwired into your brain and has nothing to do with your feelings towards other races in terms of equality. I’m not attracted to guys taller than me, am I bigoted against tall people? Get real

  • Kristopher L

    I really hate this debate. As a white guy who actually doesn’t really find other white guys all that attractive nor do i date white guys, i love guys of all ethnicities. So to me the whole “no Asian, no blacks” thing I don’t understand, if you are not interested just don’t answer, or hit the block button, or just say sorry i’m not interested. there is no need to write that, you’re just an asshole. but at the same time you do see a lot of profiles of asian guys with “asians only” or black guys with “black only” on their profile but their the first to bitch and moan if they see a profile that says “white only”. and it’s always ok for them to write that. this whole other races’ attack on the white guys is getting really lame.
    You cannot force someone to be attracted to who they are not attracted to, their upbringing or whatever has nothing to do with it. it’s in the attraction. i love asian guys but if an ugly one approaches me my dick ain’t getting hard, so no go.
    i was at a friend’s place a couple of years ago, he’s asian, and in the span of ten minutes while looking at his grinder he says “oh this fucking loser says no asians, that racist asshole” to a few minutes later “I fucking hate this, this white guy has Asian+++ on his profile, like we’re a fucking fetish, goddamn rice queen”. to “Ugh this fat guy messaged me, like as if i would ever have sex with a fat guy” i just looked at him and told him he was a complete moron, some black or asian guys complain when guys aren’t “into” them and they complain when they are “into” them.
    It’s about preference and it’s not racist to have sexual preference towards other races. how you deliver your point of you or express your preference is what makes it racist. Choosing not to associate/be friends with a certain race is racist. but when it comes to sex, no it’s not.

  • ReadySetGO

    To ask whether having an explicit racial preference for attraction is flat out racist, is to ignore the spectrum of racial prejudice. It may not be flat out “OMGRACIST,” but it displays a level of racial insensitivity and prejudice and this is it:

    By having a strict racial preference a person is assuming that all people who fall under that category are categorically the same, and that is simply not true. This highlights the difference between saying “I am not attracted to redheads” (I myself find them hot lol) and “I am not attracted to ___insert any race____.”

    What’s the difference? The difference is that a race is NOT a physical trait. period. Further, a race does NOT indicate how each individual of that race acts or present themselves. period. Sure, many physical traits are common within certain races, but there are plenty of outliers. Thus, saying “I don’t find black guys attractive,” “I don’t find THAT specific black guy attractive (since I’ve actually seen him and know what he looks like),” and “I don’t find the thick, curly hair that the majority of black people have” is saying three VERY different things. Hint: one of those statements is flat out racially prejudice, and, some might say, “racist” – but even using that word is only semantics, and pretending that there’s only racist or there’s not is, as stated above, to ignore the reality of racial in/sensitivity and the spectrum that it really is. But that’s another topic altogether.

    Now, here’s an example of how racial preferences are driven not by physical attraction, but on solely racial grounds: Let’s say someone finds blond, blue-eyed men irresistible, but do not like Latinos. Then let’s say there’s a guy, we’ll call him Jose, and he is blond, with blue-eyes, and physically, everything that our hypothetical main man would find super sexy. But Jose is also Latino, therefore our hypo main man rejects him outright with a “I’m not into Latinos” refrain. Jose was rejected not because of his looks, but because of his RACE. And therein lies the unfortunate racial prejudice and reality at the root of the racial preference. The preference isn’t about looks, it’s JUST about race.

    The bottom line is that the “racist” aspect of having an explicit racial preference is not the preference itself, but the assumptions made of other races made when making those preferences. The assumption that everyone under whatever race is the same, and you don’t like whatever it is you assume about ALL people of that race.

    And finally, even if anyone disagrees with what I’ve written above, we should all be proactive about how we communicate and the messages we send, the way they affect other people, particularly among minorities. Even if you don’t feel there’s anything socially repugnant about stating that you’re “not into black guys, latinos, only into Asians/whites,” etc/whatever combo of races, the message you’re sending, and particularly the message you send to others on the negative end of your racial stick, is a resounding “I don’t want to get to know you, I don’t want to sleep with you, I don’t care about your personality, I don’t even care what you LOOK like, because you are _____fill in the blank race____,” even if those words never crossed your mind. So please, be mindful of the world we live in. It kills me to see the negativity purposely or unintentionally conveyed by the LGBTQ community in the racial strata, when we too struggle as minority group.

  • Henry

    I know that this debate has been going on and on for a long time but it’s a good thing that it is spoken about openly rather than buried under the rug like so many people wan to to make it so.
    First, I would like to say that saying “No___insert whatever criteria here___” is just flat out prejudice (unless it’s something along the line of No assholes or No rude people). That’s essentially saying “I’m sorry but you’re not good enough to even talk to me”. And coupled with the fact that so many profiles have this and something the line of “I’m so nice hit me up” is extremely hypocritical and ironical!

    Next, these kind of statements stem from ignorance and laziness. Sure there are traits that are very common in every race, that is part of what defines races in general, but when it comes to dating shouldn’t it be best to judge on case to case basis. No body wants to be pre-judged by whatever stereotypes labeled on them, and if you don’t like it then don’t do it to others. I feel that most guys who defend this sort of behavior as perfectly OK just don’t really comprehend the issues because they can just hop on to the next playground available (particularly the light skin ones-notice I didn’t say White here), which consists of of the majority. Blacks and Asians are the minority, we feel the pain because we are on the receiving end. Asians take up 5% of the U.S coupled with being gay that number would dwindles to be borderline insignificant in the gay world. The ones in the more “major” races can just decline you and hop on the next one. In a sense, they don’t lose any since there are so many others to choose from. Where as minorities suffer the opposite way, especially if they go for whites, which are notorious for sticking to themselves.

    And lastly, the term “preference” is highly PC bullshit. When you prefer A over B, you still remain open to B occasionally. But most people when they prefer race A almost always shut out completely the other races: no taking, no friendship etc. Now this is the harmful part because it puts up a huge barrier that objectifies people. I’m sure all of us have experienced instances in which someone we didn’t initially find attractive (maybe even ugly) gradually becomes much better looking in our eyes because we get to know them so that all of their flaws become insignificant, maybe even turn into plusses in the end. By putting up that racial prejudice you essentially eliminate that possibility from the get go. And to those who want to use that trite defense “If I’m not attracted to women does it make me sexist?”, No. Because we are programmed to like members of the same sex. We wouldn’t even be able to like sexually/romantically even if we try. On the other hand, racial preferences can be changed by many factors. I dare bet my head on it that where you live, who you hang out with and what environment you grow up in play major roles in determining your preferences. Want proof? There are countless instances where those who adamantly insist that they are only attracted to race X suddenly find their tastes changed to those they initially resist when they move to areas that are heavily populated by the other race. In an ideal world when every race is at least generally portrayed as equal in beauty, then clearly it is fair for any one to pick any one else because the biases are removed. Too dang bad though, in this world there is one particularly set of ideals of beauty that is clearly and undeniably marketed and biased over, and thats why there exists an imbalance (thats why a disproportionate amount of minorities (Asians and Blacks to name the most prominent groups) heavily go for white and/or their own but not the other ones). Of course there are always exceptions, but that doesn’t invalidate the huge general trends that should be very obvious by now.

    In the end, sure, you can do what you want as it is your right. But be mindful and try to be open minded. It may not suddenly flip a switch but I’m dead sure that that can help solve a vey significant part of the problem.

  • Abdullah

    Right on the spot. Thank you.

  • belladonnamadon

    I love your comment. And I’m starting to see its pretty hard to get people to understand that.

  • belladonnamadon

    All the comments here remind me of a old saying people told me when I was young for people of color ( Black,Latino,Asian etc…) . – IF YOU EVER GET SO RELAXED AND HAPPY AND FORGET ABOUT RACE FOR ONE MOMENT, A WHITE PERSON WILL ALWAYS IN SOMEWAY REMIND U! Lol Not saying that’s right thinking but what person of color hasn’t felt that way? Fright?Lol

  • Kristopher L

    totally get what you are saying and understand it. but it’s kind of tiring to always hear the “white person” like we’re all bad. there are plenty of racist black and asian. etc people out there and it’s always ok for them to be racist. the attack on the “white person” needs to be fought in a productive way and not with racism. It’s really sad that as gay people we are trying so hard to be accepted by everyone else in the world when we can’t even treat each other with respect. booo

  • Douggseven

    If I were a parent and said the same thing to my kid but substituted the word black instead of white, I’d be deemed a terrible racist who preaches hate.

  • DeneyTerriosHair

    Reality is very different for non-whites in America. Especially for Blacks. Black parents have conversations with their children that our parents did not have with us. Back of the “reverse racism” baloney.

  • DeneyTerriosHair

    There is nothing wrong with wanting to date or fuck guys of a certain race. The problem is some guys have no tact and the disconnect of the Digital Age paves the way for crude behavior.

    Most of the couples I see look like each other. Do Black men who want a Black boyfriend hate everyone else? No. But they prefer to be with another Black guy. What about guys who have preference for hair color? Some guys like dark & swarthy, some like pale & pasty.

    I think this is really only an issue with frustrated snow queens who want more options.

  • DeneyTerriosHair

    There is plenty of porn featuring multi-ethnic men or just one ethnicity entirely: Black, Latin, Asian, or White. We CAN have it all!

  • Henry

    We are humans. Every time we want something (and work for it) and we are denied it we feel frustrated, especially when it’s about the things we can’t control. The feeling is similar to go selling something (cookies for example) door to door and 90% of the houses you knock slam the door in your face. Sure it’s better to develop thick skin and say “Whatever ” but still, the feeling can be extremely hard to swallow. But the issue is largely “Oh heck, It’s not my problem therefore it’s not problem”. This lack of empathy is sadly what humans are so damn susceptible too, and especially in a community that so desperately needs it such as ours.!!

  • DeneyTerriosHair

    Outright racism and nasty attitude online & in general is a problem. Guys wanting a bed mate of their choice is not a problem.

    There is no moral obligation in hooking-up or coupling-up. Most of us are rejected far more frequently than not. If someone is knocking on the same doors and is rejected 90% of the time then they need self evaluation. It may be time to start knocking on doors in a different neighborhood.

  • Henry

    To use that analogy, that’s only fine if there are a good number, even better if unlimited, of neighborhoods to knock on. One doesn’t work, cool, move on to the next. Too bad, a) you can only knock on so many before burning out (we’re humans, and we have limited endurance) and b) there are only so many even available. Sure, most of us being rejected more often than not is a fact, I agree for whatever reason: education, interests, personality, blah blah blah you name them. But when you’re rejected by a criteria you have no control over that automatically puts you at a whole heap of disadvantages, which is the result of may societal pressures, then it’s a different story. It’s not the existence of preferences that matters (there are and there always will be). It’s the WHY AND HOW of the disproportionate and overwhelming imbalances of one preference over many others that raise eyebrows!

  • SAC

    It’s Racism and If I see it on someone profile it turns me right off don’t have the time of day for people like that. Personally I don’t give a fack if someone is not into me being a multi mix person I deal with it a lot but as the saying goes “to each their own”. Just dont’ be like this guy http://happyplace.someecards.com/24582/amazingly-sexist-racist-offensive-craigslist-dating-ad-asian-funny

  • Douggseven

    It must be nice to have no preferences and that a 90 year old 400 lbs hillbilly with numerous STDs can get you up.

  • SAC

    That maybe be your preferences but please keep it to yourself, and to some how imply that the reason people have racial preferences is because they don’t want to catch “numerous STDs” is plain crude, ignorant, and shows what type of person you are.

  • Douggseven

    That’s not even what I meant. I was saying that everyone has a preference. Just because race can be one, doesn’t mean it’s racist by definition. If your preferences never involve race, then more power to you – but attraction is a weird beast that mostly has nothing to one’s feelings towards another race. I work with Asians all day and I consider many my friends – but I could never sleep with one. It’s just not in me. I’m sure age or weight plays a factor for you. What’s the difference?

  • Gem

    I don’t think people should base their attraction on the colour of ones skin. racism is such a personal topic for everyone black and white people should avoid being so selective based on race. People should train themselves to see through race. For me personally there is always a slight level of attraction to a guy not based on race but on the whole package. But I wouldn’t rule out anyone based on any physical trait. attraction for me is based more on an emotional connection than a physical one.
    If someone only like blond hair and blue eyes than a black guy can just die his hair blond wear contact lenses and you should be attracted to that.

  • Hi Adam, I’ve written a response to your article on my blog: http://endracismandhomophobia.tumblr.com/post/81024377459/worst-article-ive-read-this-year-is-racial
    I think it would be great if you did some research into white race theory, invisible whiteness, and white privilege. I also think you shouldn’t ignore the effect our culture has on creating an unfair bias in favour of whiteness, and that this bias is what creates racism on gay men’s profiles.

  • John

    eye

    noun

    1. each of a pair of globular organs in the head through which people
    and vertebrate animals see, the visible part typically appearing
    almond-shaped in animals with eyelids.

    Does this definition give you an all-encompassing knowledge on what eyes are and how they work?

    car·rot

    noun

    1. a tapering orange-colored root eaten as a vegetable.

    2. the cultivated feathery-leaved plant of the parsley family that yields this vegetable.

    Does this definition give you an all-encompassing
    knowledge on what carrots are, their characteristics, and nutrient
    information?

    ba·by

    noun

    1. a very young child, esp. one newly or recently born.

    Does this definition give you an all-encompassing knowledge on babies, how to raise them and what care they need?

    bird

    noun

    1. a warm-blooded egg-laying vertebrate distinguished by the
    possession of feathers, wings, and a beak and (typically) by being able
    to fly.

    Does this definition give you an all-encompassing
    knowledge on birds, their different species, how they work, their
    internal systems, and what kind of care they need or what areas they
    live in?

    mam·mal

    noun

    1. a warm-blooded vertebrate animal of a class that is distinguished
    by the possession of hair or fur, the secretion of milk by females for
    the nourishment of the young, and (typically) the birth of live young.

    Does this definition give you an all-encompassing
    knowledge on mammals, their different species, their biology, or what
    areas they live in or can survive in?

    Then how does the definition of racism provide you the
    all-encompassing knowledge of racism, how it works, it’s manifestations,
    and characteristics?

    (stolen from tumblr but applies this is particular conversation)

  • Nice. I’m stealing this too. Thanks John.

  • Me

    Yes, people may have a “racial preference,” (whether from being conditioned in a society that is teeming with institutionalized racism, or if it really is genetically hardwired into their brain) but that doesn’t entitle them to explicitly state that they aren’t attracted to a person of a particular ethnicity. Having a profile that says “no xyz” implies a negative association with characteristic xyz, much like “xyz only” implies a positive association with characteristic xyz. Usually, you’ll find “no asians” or “no blacks” versus “whites only” teeming on grindr profiles. How many “no whites” or “asians only” profiles do you see? And before you find me that *one* guy that does have that on his profile, how many times did you have to read “no asians” before you hit that one? Maybe if we didn’t live in such a racist world stating your racial preference wouldn’t be as bad, but guess what: we fucking don’t. Here in the United States, our economy is FOUNDED ON A SLAVE ECONOMY. How can you deny the implicit racism being stated in these profiles? Idealizing whiteness and implying that a person of a particular race is undesirable…what kind of privileged ass do you have to be to think you have the *audacity* to state this publicly? First and foremost, you state it is a “preference.” Then why, oh why, do I see so many profiles that literally ONLY state a racial preference? Why not-on top of that-state that they like short or tall guys, blonde or brunette dudes, blue-eyed or green-eyes demigods? Are these people really only attracted to white dudes? And all white dudes? Seriously? Whenever someone messages me who I have no real interest in talking to, I tend to ignore that person unless they are actually verbally harassing me. If you’re going to stick by “it’s just a preference,” then why do you only feel entitled to state your racial preference? What exactly *pushes* you into bluntly stating, “I only like white dudes, sorry” versus “I only like guys who are 5’11 and weigh 153 lbs, and are toned but not overly muscular?” Okay, maybe that example is a little bit specific, but do you get what I’m saying? It goes into the “no fats, no fems, no fags” mentality. The idealized male in our society is the jocky, toned, in-shape, heteronormative, white dude. The “white” part comes as a result of the institutionalized racism that plagues pretty much every culture in this world. To simply argue over semantics-over whether it really is racist to prefer one race over another-is an aversion tactic that allows someone to ignore the true issue at hand: that we DO live in a world where racism is STILL very much prevalent. Maybe these men don’t mean to come off as racist, but simply hiding behind “it’s just a preference” only allows this institutionalized racism to fester. You’re providing them an excuse instead of actually dealing with the situation at hand. Imagine if you were a gay asian man cruising through grindr, and profile after profile after profile states “no asians” “no asians” “white only” “no asians sorry.” “Sorry” I dismissed an entire subset of the human population because of their particular race. It is this homogenizing attitude- combined with the implicit racism we encounter in our day-to-day lives- that makes “racial preferences” problematic. If you really don’t find a particular race attractive, then just don’t respond to the people you aren’t attracted to. You do it all the time. Privilege, people. It’s a thing.

  • freeThinker

    That is a red herring, this is not about having “all-encompassing knowledge” . Are you John claiming to have “all-encompassing knowledge” about racism or anything else for that matter?

    If the discussion is about racism then the definition of that concept is central and it is right for Adam to discuss it.

    Interesting in your little piece of rhetoric all your examples are of concrete terms, “bird”, “baby” etc; as opposed to the abstract political term “racism”.

    Replace all your concrete terms with other abstract political terms like “democracy”, “free speech” and “human rights” and the emptiness of your rhetoric is revealed.

  • freeThinker

    MasQuline is a Social Justice Warrior type, he belongs to that deconstructionist/feminist/neo marxist radical grouping where “privileged”, “cismale”, “heteronormative” white guys are the “class enemy” and the goal is to “smash the patriarchy!” and “overthrow Capitalism” .

    In the mind of the SJW they believe they are “fighting for social justice!” so anyone who dares to disagree with them is immediately labelled “against social justice!”

    Its too bad that these SJW types have gained so much influence with their self righteous nonsense.

  • freeThinker

    I am sexually attracted to Caucasian facial features. So that means European, middle eastern, some Indian, and some mixed race guys.

    This is hard wired, it is not the result of social conditioning, my sexual attraction is not socially constructed.

    In my city there are lots of recent gay Asian immigrants, they hit the scene and chase after white guys. They were born and raised in some Asian country with very little interaction with white guys if any at all, except maybe on TV and film, and even then they would have to make an effort to seek it out. How could these gay asians have been socially conditioned to be attracted to white guys – a few hours a week of TV/film that they have actively seeked out, compared to being full immersed in an Asian culture surrounded by family and friends and the community?

    The social constructionist claim about sexual attraction falls over.

    Also the Social Justice Warriors are conflating sexuality and politics. Do they think because I am sexually disinterested in asians that I must believe they don’t have the right to vote or share the same public swimming pool as me?

    The Social Justice Warriors are trying to dictate who I should be seen dating and sleeping with. That the religious right do the same thing is an irony completely lost on the SJWs.

  • Henry

    This is an example of a myopic point of view that may sound somewhat reasonable on the surface but actually very unsophisticated when analyzed. Regarding the example you listed, Asian cultures’ ideal of beauty placed very Caucasian features on the top. Go to Asia and you will see Asian models with very close to Caucasian features or only white, rarely you will see dark-skin features to be flaunted in the media. Also, immigrants generally want to assimilate one way or another. The biggest, most influential group in the US is and always have been white. It’s really no surprise for a large, disproportionate portion run after this group. With your logic, then these Asian immigrants should run equally for Blacks, Latino, Middle Eastern at the same rate. That is clearly not the case. Now that’s your ignorant hard-wired claim falls flat on its face by just that simple observation. Or I seriously hope that these huge groups of Asians are wired to just follow whites only and somehow genetic lotteries make them less predisposed for other groups.

    Regarding your other claims, it is fine to be ignorant and bury your head in the sand because it is your right, but it is a sad act to be disillusioned by fearing people are telling you what to do.

  • Mlance38

    @kristopherl:disqus Your tired! Let me tell you, as a black guy I’M TIRED! I’m tired of being followed in the stores, I’m tired of the media always saying we are criminals, I’m tired of being discriminated on every institutional level. I’m tired of having me words being less valued only have a white guy to come in and say the exact thing and people treat it like gold. How easy is it for you to wish for tolerance just because you feel discomforted and shame on me for calling people out because I want to be seen as a HUMAN BEING! If your “tired” of racism against white people then you need to toughen up, forgive me if I’m unsympathetic but I’m TIRED of catering to every offence the white man feels and making myself ashamed just because I got angry. I wont say black people are a perfect group, and I will even go as far to say 50% of our problems are self created but it’s difficult to focus on them when the other 50% are coming from outside forces constantly threatening your existence because of the color of your skin. I can guarantee you, we all may have problems but I would trade mines for yours any day of the week.
    To loosely quote wise white people
    -I’m colorblind
    -Racism doesn’t exists any more
    -I never owned white slaves
    -Race is an illusion
    -GET OVER IT!

  • Mlance38

    FYI, This was from anger (not from you) I’m a bit cool down now

  • josh

    People act like this is black & white. No pun intended.

    There is a DIFFERENCE between having a preference, and closing yourself off to an entire race, and putting something in your dating profile that says, “No Asians” or “No Black” I prefer guys with dark hair for example but Im not exclusive to them, Ill date a guy with blond hair because I know that there are going to be some that Im attracted to. I wouldn’t put “NO Light Haired Guys” in my profile unless I had some deep seeded issue or prejudice

  • Effrem Adams

    There is over 1 BILLION people in China, and that doesn’t even include the other 48 different Asian nationalities that are out there. I would be a fool to say that there’s no possibility whatsoever of me finding an Asian person to be hot/attractive.

    People are so shallow. Indians aren’t my first pick, nor do I activity seek them out, but to say “No Indians” as if there’s not a single Indian on this earth that would tickle my fancy is retarded. Maybe not around here but I bet if I went on a trip to India where the cream of the crop is I’d be getting laid.

  • Daniel

    Racial preference is just that a preference. and I can quite comfortably say that I would NEVER date or root an Indian a Black person a Saudi or Middle Eastern. I would never actively seek an Asian but some are really hot there is no doubt there.. But to pick on people because of their preference it wrong and cruel and then to call them racist is just your own ignorance showing through and YOU not those with preference should be ashamed

  • daniel

    also Just gonna put it out there. About the races mentioned. I have never once been attracted to them and this is my point about preference!

  • ddd

    but if you’re not attracted to asians, what can ya do? should I be attracted to asians just to be politically correct? i’d rather sleep with what I’m attracted to.

  • blargh_11

    You can NOT put “not into asians, sorry that’s just my preference” on your profile. The line between preferences and racism becomes clear when people put that on their profile. If you’re not into someone, don’t answer their message. No need to put it out there. You wouldn’t go around on the street saying ” sorry, not into making friends with black people, just my preferences” so why would it be ok to put it on a dating profile?
    And a lot of times when people hide behind the flimsy excuse of “preferences”, they’re not questioning the fact that society has conditioned us all to affirm that to be a white, toned, masculine (and bearded with the current trend) is to be desirable. Anybody outside of that narrowed spectrum isn’t as desirable. Need proof? Look at all the ads in magazines and TV. In fact, look at the ads on the sides of this page. When was the last time you saw an asian or black man in a real jock ad? You’re attracted to what the media is telling you what is attractive. You should be asking why these different types are not being portrayed as sexual beings. One of the danger of the gay community is that we are complacent with the idea of “homonormative”. That means white, fit, masculine male is all that represents us but that’s far from the truth. The irony of a rainbow flag representing our community yet I don’t see a lot of colors being waving around.m

  • phillip

    I disagree with the preference bullshit. We are in a country where people idolize whiteness and that is the issue point blank period. I love all kinds of men and I have seen beauty in every group. I find it interesting that I have met European men from various nation that had a genuine interest in me. I’ve dated men from nations that haven’t allowed their minds to be tainted with the fear of going outside of their ethnic group. This is not to say racism is exclusive to the US. The history of status, oppression and racism is the catalyst for these so-called preferences. read some sociology books, trust me we are indoctrinated with this crap at an early age.

  • ddd

    I don’t feel like asking “why”, and stop acting like the US is the entire world. Asian men are desired in asian countries just as much as white men are desired here. If you think about it, the US is a very young country, that predominately started as White/Black – there has been little time, in comparison to a place like Europe, for the norms you’re hoping for to be a reality. EDIT: And sexuality is NOT just a simple thing where you can be attracted to everyone – that is just not reality for anyone, don’t be ridiculous.

  • Josh

    PREACH!! I am sitting here readng this comment and applauding.. You said this for a lot of us my brother. THANK YOU! WOOO Lord knows I’m TIRED too.

  • Josh

    Now, wait a minute, see…. (sigh) OK…there is a difference between a preferrence and a prejudice. I am Black. Now, if I say, I prefer other men of color, (Black hispanic etc) that is not racist because it means that while I may lean towards other mean of color, I am still OPEN to dating a white dude. However, if I will ONLY date men of color and will not even open myself up to the idea of dating a white dude and i say things like NO white dudes, then THAT is a prejudice. See the difference? Now, people like what they like but I don’t understand people who say they just don’t find a certain races attractive, there are beautiful men in every race, and I bet you the guys that claim they have never found a man of a certain race attractive don’t even have a passport.